injected alcohol timing

[Isaacm8803]

Hello I have an alcohol injected 496 bbc with enderle bird that we're trying to get tuned then add nitrous too. When we started it with the timing light on it the thing wouldn't run without 45 degrees of timing in it. Is this even possible or do i have a problem somewhere.It sounds good and throttle response is good. Thanks for any help Terry

[demented]

Depends on many variables. What are you using for a harmonic balancer? What do you have for compression?

[Isaacm8803]

its an 8 in fluidamper 15 to 1 j&e pistons mallory ignition eagle rods and crank. I also am a mud racer so if u dont mind me asking what gears do you run. I have a 488 in the rear with 44in tire and 456 front with a 40 in tire. So far I've had trouble gettong this motor to come up on rpm like thats too high of a gear. It runs 1 to 1 thru a chain drive. I havn't ran it with the nos yet just motor. Any help would be greatly appreciated

[curtisreed]

The first thing I thought of was have you verified that your pointer is at top dead center?

Curtis

[gimmemud]

What timing light are you using, I am not familar with Mallory ignition, but MSD ignition will mess with certain timing lights.

As far as the gear, in my opinion thats way too high, with a nos engine I always shoot for around 11.50-1 ration in first gear. What trans and what is the gear ratio in fisst gear.

[Isaacm8803]

Yes I just put a brand new tab on it the key is not sheared off i checked that too. And im not sure about the timing light its nothing special just an ordinary off the shelf one. As far as the gearing its a glide with a 1.76 low gear

[altune]

We had the same deal on a MSD setup. The tech guy told me to reverse the signal wires and then check it. It seems sometimes they ship them with the wires being put in the wrong side of the connector.
Al

[gimmemud]

We had the same deal on a MSD setup. The tech guy told me to reverse the signal wires and then check it. It seems sometimes they ship them with the wires being put in the wrong side of the connector.
Al

I agree it could be the purple and green wires need to be reversed. I had one do that one time, reversed the wires and fixed it.

On the gear ratio, for 200' mud drags its just about impossible to get too low of a gear ratio. A 6.00 gear would get you to a 11.44-1 ratio in low gear. The front is the tricky one, with a 40" tire on front I would probably try to get around a 5.50 ratio in the front, this should be able to be corrected in the sprocket arrangment to the front driveshaft, without changing ring and pinion.

[demented]

As far as timing is concerned 45 degrees on alcohol is not unheard of but its rare. I would tend to think that there is somthing wrong, maybe pointer, maybe cam timing, wrong converter. What is your convertor rated for.

The guys were right about the timing lights too. There has been may problems linked back to timing lights. I had a problem with one just recently. Drove me nuts.

I have 4.88's in my car as well with 44's on the rear and its 1-1 thru a chaindrive to the front. I have a 5600 stall converter and I turn my 632 to 8000 using only first and second gear. I don't think that the gears are your problem.

[demented]

Also is this fuel injection unit new? If so you could be running too rich.

[gimmemud]

As far as timing is concerned 45 degrees on alcohol is not unheard of but its rare. I would tend to think that there is somthing wrong, maybe pointer, maybe cam timing, wrong converter. What is your convertor rated for.

The guys were right about the timing lights too. There has been may problems linked back to timing lights. I had a problem with one just recently. Drove me nuts.

I have 4.88's in my car as well with 44's on the rear and its 1-1 thru a chaindrive to the front. I have a 5600 stall converter and I turn my 632 to 8000 using only first and second gear. I don't think that the gears are your problem.


Fred are you running a 3 speed tranny or a Powerglide?

[demented]

TH 400. I love the combo. Why do you think I need a gear change. Always open to suggestions.

[gimmemud]

No your probably really close, but the poster, Isaac, is running a powerglide and his gear ratio is way too high unless he is running 1/8 mile. :wink: With a powerglide he needs more gear. in low gear with a 1.76 glide he has a 8.59 final ratio, you with a th400 have a 12.10 in low gear, then you shift to second and that gives you a 7.22, so imagine you trying to start in 2nd gear, you would have too high a ratio. Not trying tto argue just showing the difference with a powerglide and 3 spd.

I have ran as low as 7.33 gear with a 1.80 planetary, (13.19 final ratio in low) with awesome results on short tracks, but the pinion was too small to handle the power, about 5 passes and it broke.

[gimmemud]

By the way are you going to that race in NY tomorrow, if so good luck.

[demented]

Sorry :cry: didn't see that we were talking glides. Yeah that would be to high of a gear. Not a fan of powerglides. I like the three speeds they seem to keep the motor in the powerband better.

Yeah, I'm going to the schaticoke N.Y. race. I live an hour from the track so I'm as good as there. Car's in the trailer, and the trailers with me at work, so , I'm off like a prom dress :shock: .

I'll post some results later on www.mudracersassociation.com

[Isaacm8803]

Thanks alot guys. You have given me alot of useful info. I'm gonna try timing it with a different light, but the motor sounds really good and crisp so I don't think there is anything seriously wrong. I took it out lastnight and whacked it one time with a 350 shot of nos and it really came to life compared to what it was doing without it. So with a little more tuning and a gear change I may accidentaly get it to run. To answer your ques, the inj. is not new but good vibes out in Cali told me that i should start with 34-36 flowed nozzles with a 120 main and the converter is a 5600 turbo converter. Thanks again

[demented]

Sounds like the fuel system is right. Still might be a touch rich but real close. Good vibes are good people they do know there sh1t. Double check your timing with a different light but the best think to do would be to verify your timing marks first.

Also if the motor was built for nitrous it will be sluggish without nitrous so keep that in mind.