Has anyone else had a bad experience with Naylor Racing??
01-08-2013, 06:27 AM
#104
Senior Member
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 936
Originally Posted by proactionheads
Now that the holidays are over, I will try and respond to what’s been said by Mr. Humphries in this Forum. Foremost, Bill got the motor he paid for! Before building him the motor, many conversations were had, estimates drawn up, and e-mails sent. The 1100hp motor with Brodix 395MC heads, shaft rockers, Profiler tunnel ram intake, and belt drive cost $1400.00+ and was beyond his budget. Working within his $11500.00 budget, I offered a 632ci using Dart 400m heads which I would work on for no cost to make the most hp possible. If he had the time to wait on the heads to come in, and for me to do the work on them, I would do it for $11500, and it would run excellent times in his dragster. Once the build was started, Bill called several times checking on progress and was updated on what parts came in and how the head work was coming. We sent him pictures of the heads so he could see the work I had already done. His response was he couldn’t tell any work had been done, we were beyond our 4-6 week time agreement, and he wanted 1100hp. What? That was not agreed on for this motor! Apparently all the previous conversations about us helping him out by building him the most motor for $11500 went in one ear and out the other. Once we started the build no time frame was guaranteed, I was doing the work on the heads on my time at no cost! And YES there were extras I didn’t charge him for (Head work, intake work, drilled intake for injectors, and upgrade to Moroso dragster oil pan @ no cost to him). At this point to make things right I offered him a deal on a complete short block for $7148, this way he could save his money for a top end that would ultimately make him the 1100 hp he was chasing. He declined that offer because he said he was getting such a good deal on the motor I was in the process of making now. I stopped all other work in the shop to get this motor finished for him so he could pick it up ASAP. No the motor was not run on our dyno before it left. First, he wanted the motor now! Secondly, due to his attitude, and all the prep it would have taken to get ready to run (his vac pump, mandrel, carb linkage and brackets all came off his Mopar), and doing this at my expense, I had no problem not running this motor for him. (It took him 3 weeks to get the engine ready to dyno at the shop that did run it).
A 632 ci motor with 400m heads, tunnel ram with two Rons terminators on alcohol will make 1050hp. The Dyno numbers he posted look low. For a motor to drop off like it did it appears to have fuel issues to me. This motor should turn 7500 rpm with this big top end. I know this engine will run great in a dragster, I wish he would put it in and see for himself.
Intake gasket issue- The Dart 400m head has a raised runner. The intake took 1.120 and 1.060 gaskets we used 3M to glue together, it should not have leaked. If this thickness was not put back on, the intake runners will not line up with the head runners. Maybe his is his issue?
Oiling problem- I never had a BBC that had oiling problems to the top end. Maybe they didn’t prime it? If they had primed it they should have noticed that the rockers were not getting oil then, not when they were running it.
He doesn’t like my shop? I have been in business, at the same location, for 24 years. Everyone is welcome to visit. Here is a list of some of the equipment I have in my 2400sq. ft. machine shop. Sunnen VR 6000 valve grinder, Serdi valve grinder, Pro-Bal balancer, 7’ Magnaflux inspection machine, Sunnen rod machine, 54” Victor lathe, Super Flow flow bench, Sunnen CV616 honing machine, Quik-Way honing machine, Sunnen line hone machine, Rottler boring machine, DCM with BHJ decking fixture, Scledum CVN machine, 54” Bridgeport, twin brake Stuska dyno.
A 632 ci motor with 400m heads, tunnel ram with two Rons terminators on alcohol will make 1050hp. The Dyno numbers he posted look low. For a motor to drop off like it did it appears to have fuel issues to me. This motor should turn 7500 rpm with this big top end. I know this engine will run great in a dragster, I wish he would put it in and see for himself.
Intake gasket issue- The Dart 400m head has a raised runner. The intake took 1.120 and 1.060 gaskets we used 3M to glue together, it should not have leaked. If this thickness was not put back on, the intake runners will not line up with the head runners. Maybe his is his issue?
Oiling problem- I never had a BBC that had oiling problems to the top end. Maybe they didn’t prime it? If they had primed it they should have noticed that the rockers were not getting oil then, not when they were running it.
He doesn’t like my shop? I have been in business, at the same location, for 24 years. Everyone is welcome to visit. Here is a list of some of the equipment I have in my 2400sq. ft. machine shop. Sunnen VR 6000 valve grinder, Serdi valve grinder, Pro-Bal balancer, 7’ Magnaflux inspection machine, Sunnen rod machine, 54” Victor lathe, Super Flow flow bench, Sunnen CV616 honing machine, Quik-Way honing machine, Sunnen line hone machine, Rottler boring machine, DCM with BHJ decking fixture, Scledum CVN machine, 54” Bridgeport, twin brake Stuska dyno.
Originally Posted by mrmopar622
Again, more lies & excuses from Naylor Racing Engines/Pro Action Heads. I would think any reputable engine builder would want to check into any problems on an engine he had built not make excuses.
As for the 3 weeks before getting the engine dynoed, I had to wait for my turn in line! Thanks to Jimmy Naylor's poor workmanship it cost an extra $348.76, parts & labor, another $80+ for new oil & filter, where he put 2 intake gaskets instead of the proper one-one had slipped leaking water into the engine. Everything including the extra trip cost me over $1,000.00 for work that should have already been done by Naylor. He refused to reimburse the $348.76 plus oil & filter to correct his poor workmanship much less the $1,000.00. When priming the engine that is where we found the oiling problem to the rockers. We cranked it & run it long enough to make sure it was not getting oil to the rockers. HAD THE DYNO OPERATOR NOT DISCOVERED THIS THE ENGINE WOULD NOW BE NOT JUST LOW ON HORSEPOWER BUT JUNK! The dyno work was done by one of the best men in the Southeast with the latest state-of-the-art dyno. It monitored the EGT on each cylinder at head; CO2 in each collector; fuel pressure; oil pressure & oil temp; water temp; if there would have been any kind of fuel pressure problem we would have seen it. Jimmy Naylor, do you really think anyone is going to believe the vacuum pump, fuel pump & terminators(bolt on like a carb) were Mopar parts and would not fit on a Chevrolet?
Everyone else on here can see there is a problem with this engine, and instead of addressing the problem all you have done is make excuses. WHY CAN'T YOU SEE THIS??? You can not solve a problem by making excuses.
Everyone has seen the first & final invoice and on both invoices you put 1100+hp.
Then you try to scam us with an invoice you say you sent with the Head Hunter 395 cfm heads and that was the 1100 hp engine, but you had to substitute with the Dart 400 Big M heads to stay in my budget.
If everyone would please go back up & look at his bogus invoice you will see the engine build with the Brodix Head Hunter Heads is for a 600 cu in engine, it even says it on the invoice, the second invoice, the engine you say I chose because of budget, is a 632 cu in engine build - Jimmy Naylor this is just more inconsistent lies coming from you.
Instead of all those lies would it have not been easier to have said "Looks like we have a problem, let's see what we can do to correct it."
As for the 3 weeks before getting the engine dynoed, I had to wait for my turn in line! Thanks to Jimmy Naylor's poor workmanship it cost an extra $348.76, parts & labor, another $80+ for new oil & filter, where he put 2 intake gaskets instead of the proper one-one had slipped leaking water into the engine. Everything including the extra trip cost me over $1,000.00 for work that should have already been done by Naylor. He refused to reimburse the $348.76 plus oil & filter to correct his poor workmanship much less the $1,000.00. When priming the engine that is where we found the oiling problem to the rockers. We cranked it & run it long enough to make sure it was not getting oil to the rockers. HAD THE DYNO OPERATOR NOT DISCOVERED THIS THE ENGINE WOULD NOW BE NOT JUST LOW ON HORSEPOWER BUT JUNK! The dyno work was done by one of the best men in the Southeast with the latest state-of-the-art dyno. It monitored the EGT on each cylinder at head; CO2 in each collector; fuel pressure; oil pressure & oil temp; water temp; if there would have been any kind of fuel pressure problem we would have seen it. Jimmy Naylor, do you really think anyone is going to believe the vacuum pump, fuel pump & terminators(bolt on like a carb) were Mopar parts and would not fit on a Chevrolet?
Everyone else on here can see there is a problem with this engine, and instead of addressing the problem all you have done is make excuses. WHY CAN'T YOU SEE THIS??? You can not solve a problem by making excuses.
Everyone has seen the first & final invoice and on both invoices you put 1100+hp.
Then you try to scam us with an invoice you say you sent with the Head Hunter 395 cfm heads and that was the 1100 hp engine, but you had to substitute with the Dart 400 Big M heads to stay in my budget.
If everyone would please go back up & look at his bogus invoice you will see the engine build with the Brodix Head Hunter Heads is for a 600 cu in engine, it even says it on the invoice, the second invoice, the engine you say I chose because of budget, is a 632 cu in engine build - Jimmy Naylor this is just more inconsistent lies coming from you.
Instead of all those lies would it have not been easier to have said "Looks like we have a problem, let's see what we can do to correct it."
This was Naylor's response and Billy's response. Is there more we are looking for? About all of Billy's posts contain about the same info and Naylor's info is all about the same. It's 7 pages of the same stuff. Billy rants, Naylor responds, Billy calls him a liar and the cycle starts again.
Again..... only true way to solve this is put it on Naylor's dyno and see if it puts out the #'s that Billy wants or what Naylor says it should make.
01-13-2013, 11:02 AM
#105
Member
JUNIOR BUILDER
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 74
I have been holding off on a reply. I was thinking maybe if I did not put Naylor into a defensive position, he might respond positively. I think I have proved my point - it is not what it was advertised to be nor what I paid for. When I first emailed Naylor about the engine problems & lack of horsepower, I told him I thought things should be made right, if nothing else, I should receive some form of compensation.
So, I am putting that back out there again. Something we could both be somewhat satisfied with, and everyone could see that Naylor stands behind his work. Who knows, that might improve his business.
So, I am putting that back out there again. Something we could both be somewhat satisfied with, and everyone could see that Naylor stands behind his work. Who knows, that might improve his business.
01-14-2013, 04:17 PM
#106
Senior Member
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Augusta, Ga.
Posts: 2,276
Originally Posted by mrmopar622
I have been holding off on a reply. I was thinking maybe if I did not put Naylor into a defensive position, he might respond positively. I think I have proved my point - it is not what it was advertised to be nor what I paid for. When I first emailed Naylor about the engine problems & lack of horsepower, I told him I thought things should be made right, if nothing else, I should receive some form of compensation.
So, I am putting that back out there again. Something we could both be somewhat satisfied with, and everyone could see that Naylor stands behind his work. Who knows, that might improve his business.
So, I am putting that back out there again. Something we could both be somewhat satisfied with, and everyone could see that Naylor stands behind his work. Who knows, that might improve his business.
It benefits both buyer and builder to have good relationships with each other to be able to resolve issues like these on racing engines.
If not this is what happens and at this point you don't want to deal with him and he doesn't want to deal with you.
The only ending solution for this is to work this out with Naylor and him fix and tune this motor or you're just going to have to deal with another builder and expect him to charge you.
01-15-2013, 06:21 AM
#107
Member
JUNIOR BUILDER
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 74
Rabbit,
Here is my $.02 reply, what goes around comes around. When you sit back & gloat at someone else's misfortune, It Will Come Back To Haunt You!!
It used to be when we bought race parts they were ready to use, out of the box. Somehow that evolved into, you should be happy we build the race parts for you, we build hundreds of thousands parts there is no way we can check each one individually. If you want perfection you need to take the parts to a machine shop and have perfection made. Now, as per Rabbit says, racing parts have no guarantee. If you take them to a machine shop/engine builder even with their guarantee when you pay them their asking price and leave their shop, if it is not Right or what you paid for, you can expect to pay another machine shop/engine builder to make it Right or what you paid for in the beginning.
I don't know about the rest of you but that is unacceptable to me. By it being a racing part/race engine, I do not expect a 100,000 mile warranty, BUT I DO EXPECT IT TO BE WHAT IT WAS ADVERTISED AND WHAT I PAID FOR AND MOST IMPORTANTLY RIGHT!
As individual racers, we have very little power, but as United Racers we have Great Power. As racers ourselves, we need to look out for our fellow racers. We should all be thankful to Racing Junk for providing us with this site, but it is a very large site and impossible for them to police everything on their own. When we see a illegitimate machine shop/engine builder advertising and selling their products on here taking advantage of our fellow racers, shouldn't each & everyone of us report them to Racing Junk and ask that their advertisement/ads be removed from the site, or should we just sit back like Rabbit and gloat at everyone's misfortune?
Here is my $.02 reply, what goes around comes around. When you sit back & gloat at someone else's misfortune, It Will Come Back To Haunt You!!
It used to be when we bought race parts they were ready to use, out of the box. Somehow that evolved into, you should be happy we build the race parts for you, we build hundreds of thousands parts there is no way we can check each one individually. If you want perfection you need to take the parts to a machine shop and have perfection made. Now, as per Rabbit says, racing parts have no guarantee. If you take them to a machine shop/engine builder even with their guarantee when you pay them their asking price and leave their shop, if it is not Right or what you paid for, you can expect to pay another machine shop/engine builder to make it Right or what you paid for in the beginning.
I don't know about the rest of you but that is unacceptable to me. By it being a racing part/race engine, I do not expect a 100,000 mile warranty, BUT I DO EXPECT IT TO BE WHAT IT WAS ADVERTISED AND WHAT I PAID FOR AND MOST IMPORTANTLY RIGHT!
As individual racers, we have very little power, but as United Racers we have Great Power. As racers ourselves, we need to look out for our fellow racers. We should all be thankful to Racing Junk for providing us with this site, but it is a very large site and impossible for them to police everything on their own. When we see a illegitimate machine shop/engine builder advertising and selling their products on here taking advantage of our fellow racers, shouldn't each & everyone of us report them to Racing Junk and ask that their advertisement/ads be removed from the site, or should we just sit back like Rabbit and gloat at everyone's misfortune?
01-15-2013, 07:58 AM
#108
Senior Member
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 936
Originally Posted by mrmopar622
, BUT I DO EXPECT IT TO BE WHAT IT WAS ADVERTISED AND WHAT I PAID FOR AND MOST IMPORTANTLY RIGHT!
Originally Posted by mrmopar622
,
As individual racers, we have very little power, but as United Racers we have Great Power. As racers ourselves, we need to look out for our fellow racers. We should all be thankful to Racing Junk for providing us with this site, but it is a very large site and impossible for them to police everything on their own. When we see a illegitimate machine shop/engine builder advertising and selling their products on here taking advantage of our fellow racers, shouldn't each & everyone of us report them to Racing Junk and ask that their advertisement/ads be removed from the site, or should we just sit back like Rabbit and gloat at everyone's misfortune?
As individual racers, we have very little power, but as United Racers we have Great Power. As racers ourselves, we need to look out for our fellow racers. We should all be thankful to Racing Junk for providing us with this site, but it is a very large site and impossible for them to police everything on their own. When we see a illegitimate machine shop/engine builder advertising and selling their products on here taking advantage of our fellow racers, shouldn't each & everyone of us report them to Racing Junk and ask that their advertisement/ads be removed from the site, or should we just sit back like Rabbit and gloat at everyone's misfortune?
You want RJ to do something about it, then see above about the attorney. They are not just going to randomly remove ads or users based on a he said/she said postings. You will need to something showin you won a fraud case and then it is possible they may consider looking at that user. Not much they can do when the user creates a new account either.
As for your comment about gloating at misfortune or sitting back, no one has done that here so I would be cautious at pointing finger and making such accusations to the members of this forum. Rabbit did all he could to help you and is giving you a 100% honest opinion.
01-15-2013, 08:27 AM
#109
Member
JUNIOR BUILDER
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 74
a 100% honest opinion.[/quote]
Opinions are like A**holes, everyone has one. It seems like your opinion of yourself you know everything, everyone else is wrong, you have all the right answers. Where is all this positive feedback for Naylor you keep referencing? I have yet to see any.
As for my honest opinion of you I could give a sh*t less what YOUR opinions are.
However, I am interested in hearing some of the other racers opinions.
Opinions are like A**holes, everyone has one. It seems like your opinion of yourself you know everything, everyone else is wrong, you have all the right answers. Where is all this positive feedback for Naylor you keep referencing? I have yet to see any.
As for my honest opinion of you I could give a sh*t less what YOUR opinions are.
However, I am interested in hearing some of the other racers opinions.
01-15-2013, 08:47 AM
#110
Senior Member
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 936
A search shows 2 positive posts for customer service.
http://forums.racingjunk.com/viewtop...proactionheads
http://forums.racingjunk.com/viewtop...proactionheads
So Rabbit is a gloatter that sits back and does nothing, Hammertime got jumped on by you and I'm an asshole. Got it. This is getting easier to see why Naylor wiped his hands clean.
http://forums.racingjunk.com/viewtop...proactionheads
http://forums.racingjunk.com/viewtop...proactionheads
So Rabbit is a gloatter that sits back and does nothing, Hammertime got jumped on by you and I'm an asshole. Got it. This is getting easier to see why Naylor wiped his hands clean.