dart little M oil restrickers?
#11
Senior Member
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: La.
Posts: 2,890
Just curious? did you have oil restrictors in the block when you had over 300 passes on the motor before the rebuild? I'm not saying that you're not pumping out 1 1/2 qts. on a hard shutdown, but i am leaning toward not enough clearance on the bearings. If you had restrictors before why didn't you reinstall them before installing the motor. I've never had this happen before, and i have a Dart L' "M" block built 434" but haven't installed it yet. I'm watch this thread very carefully, i cannot afford this to happen too me. All i have is an 8qt. pan and a high performance Moroso oil pump.
Also you didn't say what kind of rods and what bolts, did a bolt break, did a rod break. I'm still curious about where it started, except you said a main bearing went dry.
Zip.
Also you didn't say what kind of rods and what bolts, did a bolt break, did a rod break. I'm still curious about where it started, except you said a main bearing went dry.
Zip.
#12
Member
CRAFTSMAN
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: racine wisconsin
Posts: 50
the motor had billet oliver rods 6" 2.10 lj. with arp bolts. as far as the rod breaking it was still tq to specs just the bearing was missing there was about 3/4" on the caps 2" still on wrist pin/piston this motor never had restrickers in it before! in fact dart tells u not to use them
#14
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: La.
Posts: 2,890
WoW, etchison
This is not an easy one, and i feel for your loss. I'm thinking that some of the problems was with the clearance, but i'm sure that some other people will have different ideas. I personally donot use with the high dollar pans and have not had a problem with the $79.00/or less 8 qt. pans with a flap/trap door to control the shut down. I know that nothing i can say will help the pain or cost to put your engine back together, but if i was in your shoes i'd go back to what worked before.
I can say it's very hard to tell the difference on running out oil and too little clearance on the bearings.
I want to thank you for sharing your experience and i hope it doesn't happen too me.
Zip.
This is not an easy one, and i feel for your loss. I'm thinking that some of the problems was with the clearance, but i'm sure that some other people will have different ideas. I personally donot use with the high dollar pans and have not had a problem with the $79.00/or less 8 qt. pans with a flap/trap door to control the shut down. I know that nothing i can say will help the pain or cost to put your engine back together, but if i was in your shoes i'd go back to what worked before.
I can say it's very hard to tell the difference on running out oil and too little clearance on the bearings.
I want to thank you for sharing your experience and i hope it doesn't happen too me.
Zip.
#15
Senior Member
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 2,044
Originally Posted by etchison
it was a oiling issue at some point during the run the mains where going dry
I cant understand why people wont use a low oil pressure light and a low pressure shut off.
Why spend 10K or 20K on a motor and not invest $100 on a low oil pressure shut off switch?
A oil accumator is a good idea too.
I'm with zip go back to what you used before.
Sorry for your loss.
JM> 2cents Cp
#16
My new Dart Little-M stroker is almost finished and I'm at point where I need to make a final determination on the restrictors.
The people at Dart told me this about the Little-M priority main oiling and restrictors. They said, "if you're using a standard oil pump, don't run the restrictors." "But, if you're running a high-volume pump, use the restrictors."
I have a HV Moroso billet oil pump, so I currently have restrictors installed per Dart's advice. However, my plan is to use the oil primer shaft with a drill and carefully watch how-much oil is moving to the top of the engine through the lifer bores. Then based on too-little or the right amount of oil top side, I'll decide whether or not to leave, or remove the restrictors.
Also, the lifer bores have been honed in my new block and the lifters (Howards Pro-Max) feel very smooth in the bores.
So, what do you think about my plan? i.e., make a decission on the restrictors based on what I see with the top side oiling with the primer.
Warren
The people at Dart told me this about the Little-M priority main oiling and restrictors. They said, "if you're using a standard oil pump, don't run the restrictors." "But, if you're running a high-volume pump, use the restrictors."
I have a HV Moroso billet oil pump, so I currently have restrictors installed per Dart's advice. However, my plan is to use the oil primer shaft with a drill and carefully watch how-much oil is moving to the top of the engine through the lifer bores. Then based on too-little or the right amount of oil top side, I'll decide whether or not to leave, or remove the restrictors.
Also, the lifer bores have been honed in my new block and the lifters (Howards Pro-Max) feel very smooth in the bores.
So, what do you think about my plan? i.e., make a decission on the restrictors based on what I see with the top side oiling with the primer.
Warren
#17
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: NORTHEAST
Posts: 290
Look at the lifter and if the oil hole on the side of the lifter is in the oil band you could run the restrictors but if the oil feed hole is on the side of the lifter it will use the oil clearance in the lifter bore to feed with and I would not use restrictors there as its already being restricted!!
#18
Originally Posted by hink
Look at the lifter and if the oil hole on the side of the lifter is in the oil band you could run the restrictors but if the oil feed hole is on the side of the lifter it will use the oil clearance in the lifter bore to feed with and I would not use restrictors there as its already being restricted!!
I looked my Howards Pro-Max lifters over, and they appear to oil through the center of the lifter. And should not restrict oil flow.
I talked with Dart again today on the restrictor issue with my Little-M Sportsman block. They thought my idea about observing the top oiling while priming was a good idea and gave me some suggestions on what action to take if needed.
1. First check to see how well it is oiling on the top with the restrictors inplace.
2. If it isn't oiling enough, removed the restrictors and recheck.
3. Then, if it is oiling too much at the top with the restrictors remove, get 1/4" NPT plugs (inner oil plug) and drill 1/8" holes in the plugs for minimum oil restriction. FYI the outer block oil plug is 3/8" and the inner 1/4".
Warren
#20
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EXPERT BUILDER
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 267
Warren,
I just don't see how you could get a drill driven primer tool to pump up enough oil to the top side fast enough to simulate top end revs...? Uless you figure out how to hook it up ot a high speed die grinder or something?
I prime all my engines to check for oil flow to each rocker before I button it up, and I have never got enough flow to even squirt out over the edge of the heads using a [high speed] drill.
My engine builder refuses to put restrictors because he says the oil needs to cool the valve springs and upper valve train.
My argument is why then have I lost several bottom ends because all 8 quarts of oil are pumped right up and out of the valve cover tube breathers (circle track valve cover setup) and all over the engine compartment as the bottom end cavitates and welds the rods to the crank????? He can't answer that one...?
So I put the restrictors in myself after I get it home and before I put the engine in the car.
I have never lost a top end because of lack of cooling oil, but I have lost several bottom ends because of pumping all the oil right out the topside...!
Jim
I just don't see how you could get a drill driven primer tool to pump up enough oil to the top side fast enough to simulate top end revs...? Uless you figure out how to hook it up ot a high speed die grinder or something?
I prime all my engines to check for oil flow to each rocker before I button it up, and I have never got enough flow to even squirt out over the edge of the heads using a [high speed] drill.
My engine builder refuses to put restrictors because he says the oil needs to cool the valve springs and upper valve train.
My argument is why then have I lost several bottom ends because all 8 quarts of oil are pumped right up and out of the valve cover tube breathers (circle track valve cover setup) and all over the engine compartment as the bottom end cavitates and welds the rods to the crank????? He can't answer that one...?
So I put the restrictors in myself after I get it home and before I put the engine in the car.
I have never lost a top end because of lack of cooling oil, but I have lost several bottom ends because of pumping all the oil right out the topside...!
Jim