Dart or Merlin block?
10-04-2007, 08:05 PM
#1
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MASTER JOURNEYMAN
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Lowell, IN
Posts: 47
Dart or Merlin block?
Looking at a 565 short deck BBC build and wondering if there is any advantage using a Dart -vs- Merlin block. They have similiar reading specs. Just looking for your experiences with either one.
Thanks
Thanks
10-04-2007, 09:24 PM
#2
Senior Member
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: VA Hospital, Dallas, Tx (214 302 1924) cell-972-464-7400
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My opinion,
Quality control at Dart is much better.
The Dart casting just appears to be more dense or higher quality, than the Merlins. I have the most expensive Merlin Cast Iron Race Block in my shop now sitting alongside a Dart Big M with Billet Caps and it is easy to see the quality difference in the castings.
I also like the Dart lubrication system and the placing of the external oiling connections better too.
The deck ht from Dart is right on when comparing side to side.
I like the way the Dart center bolt provisions are much better than the way Merlin does them.
And last but by far not least, It will be a freezing day in Hell before World Products ever gets anymore money from me.
I paid in cash by Money Order upfront for a new Merlin II and was promised they would ship in no longer than 3 weeks. After tons of angry phone calls becuase of all the lies in Michigan and also all the lies of Mitchel jr. and after I lost my customer that block finally was delievered over 10 months later. They also charged me $250.00 for freight. I get Dart Big M blocks for less than 120.00 freight now.
The Merlin will cost a little less.
Depending on where you are I have a good source for both Merlin and Dart, but refuse to buy Merlin.
Bill Hendren here, one of the contributing members I believe can also help you in Dart Products and also I think Merlin. Give him a phone call. His number is usually included in his postings.
Hendrens Racing Engines
1310 U.S. Hwy 221 North
Rutherfordton N.C. 28139
828-286-0780 Bill, Steve, Mike
www.hendrensracingengines.com
Ed
Quality control at Dart is much better.
The Dart casting just appears to be more dense or higher quality, than the Merlins. I have the most expensive Merlin Cast Iron Race Block in my shop now sitting alongside a Dart Big M with Billet Caps and it is easy to see the quality difference in the castings.
I also like the Dart lubrication system and the placing of the external oiling connections better too.
The deck ht from Dart is right on when comparing side to side.
I like the way the Dart center bolt provisions are much better than the way Merlin does them.
And last but by far not least, It will be a freezing day in Hell before World Products ever gets anymore money from me.
I paid in cash by Money Order upfront for a new Merlin II and was promised they would ship in no longer than 3 weeks. After tons of angry phone calls becuase of all the lies in Michigan and also all the lies of Mitchel jr. and after I lost my customer that block finally was delievered over 10 months later. They also charged me $250.00 for freight. I get Dart Big M blocks for less than 120.00 freight now.
The Merlin will cost a little less.
Depending on where you are I have a good source for both Merlin and Dart, but refuse to buy Merlin.
Bill Hendren here, one of the contributing members I believe can also help you in Dart Products and also I think Merlin. Give him a phone call. His number is usually included in his postings.
Hendrens Racing Engines
1310 U.S. Hwy 221 North
Rutherfordton N.C. 28139
828-286-0780 Bill, Steve, Mike
www.hendrensracingengines.com
Ed
10-05-2007, 04:09 AM
#3
Senior Member
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 4,137
Originally Posted by edvancedengines
My opinion,
Quality control at Dart is much better.
The Dart casting just appears to be more dense or higher quality, than the Merlins. I have the most expensive Merlin Cast Iron Race Block in my shop now sitting alongside a Dart Big M with Billet Caps and it is easy to see the quality difference in the castings.
I also like the Dart lubrication system and the placing of the external oiling connections better too.
The deck ht from Dart is right on when comparing side to side.
I like the way the Dart center bolt provisions are much better than the way Merlin does them.
And last but by far not least, It will be a freezing day in Hell before World Products ever gets anymore money from me.
I paid in cash by Money Order upfront for a new Merlin II and was promised they would ship in no longer than 3 weeks. After tons of angry phone calls becuase of all the lies in Michigan and also all the lies of Mitchel jr. and after I lost my customer that block finally was delievered over 10 months later. They also charged me $250.00 for freight. I get Dart Big M blocks for less than 120.00 freight now.
The Merlin will cost a little less.
Depending on where you are I have a good source for both Merlin and Dart, but refuse to buy Merlin.
Bill Hendren here, one of the contributing members I believe can also help you in Dart Products and also I think Merlin. Give him a phone call. His number is usually included in his postings.
Hendrens Racing Engines
1310 U.S. Hwy 221 North
Rutherfordton N.C. 28139
828-286-0780 Bill, Steve, Mike
www.hendrensracingengines.com
Ed
Quality control at Dart is much better.
The Dart casting just appears to be more dense or higher quality, than the Merlins. I have the most expensive Merlin Cast Iron Race Block in my shop now sitting alongside a Dart Big M with Billet Caps and it is easy to see the quality difference in the castings.
I also like the Dart lubrication system and the placing of the external oiling connections better too.
The deck ht from Dart is right on when comparing side to side.
I like the way the Dart center bolt provisions are much better than the way Merlin does them.
And last but by far not least, It will be a freezing day in Hell before World Products ever gets anymore money from me.
I paid in cash by Money Order upfront for a new Merlin II and was promised they would ship in no longer than 3 weeks. After tons of angry phone calls becuase of all the lies in Michigan and also all the lies of Mitchel jr. and after I lost my customer that block finally was delievered over 10 months later. They also charged me $250.00 for freight. I get Dart Big M blocks for less than 120.00 freight now.
The Merlin will cost a little less.
Depending on where you are I have a good source for both Merlin and Dart, but refuse to buy Merlin.
Bill Hendren here, one of the contributing members I believe can also help you in Dart Products and also I think Merlin. Give him a phone call. His number is usually included in his postings.
Hendrens Racing Engines
1310 U.S. Hwy 221 North
Rutherfordton N.C. 28139
828-286-0780 Bill, Steve, Mike
www.hendrensracingengines.com
Ed
10-06-2007, 06:43 PM
#5
Member
MASTER JOURNEYMAN
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Lowell, IN
Posts: 47
thanks Ed,
it's hard for us new guys to know any better when you read the descriptions of each, and they are almost word for word the same. I had plans of building up my GM 4 bolt block, but after everyone's advice and asking enough questions it looks as though I might as well put in a Dart block and also add the extra cubic inches that can be pulled from the available 4.60 bore.
it's hard for us new guys to know any better when you read the descriptions of each, and they are almost word for word the same. I had plans of building up my GM 4 bolt block, but after everyone's advice and asking enough questions it looks as though I might as well put in a Dart block and also add the extra cubic inches that can be pulled from the available 4.60 bore.
10-06-2007, 07:17 PM
#8
Administrator
RACING JUNKIE
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Maine,USA
Posts: 1,204
Originally Posted by woodsman
Originally Posted by superstreeter
Or you could open another can of worms,and go with an aluminum block! save about 140 lbs,and be cooler on the street
I'd have to vote for the Dart block as well.I've got both and like the Dart better
__________________
There Is 1 Thing Better Than Cubic Inches,,,More Of Them
There Is 1 Thing Better Than Cubic Inches,,,More Of Them
10-06-2007, 08:25 PM
#9
Senior Member
DYNO OPERATOR
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: VA Hospital, Dallas, Tx (214 302 1924) cell-972-464-7400
Posts: 540
You guys might be surprised at how much torture you can putt
You guys might be surprised at how much torture you can put that old factory GM 454 or 427 block through. It is tough as a Rhino Hide.
Merlin II block was supposed to be a stronger aftermarket replacement for the Factory GM BowTie. At least it was when I ordered one.
Almost a year later when it was finally finished according to Merlin it would only accept the factory advertised max bore of 4.600 in extreme examples but would be ok at a 4.560 bore. Likewise according the Merlin (World Products) It might or might not be able to clear the 4 3/4 crank with grinding. What really made me mad was that at the time according to them that block should handle 900 to 1,000 hp.
I had already been exceeding that power level with factory production 454 blocks, so I was even more mad. By the time that block from Merlin was finally finished I had already had the Gen 5 and Gen 6 BowTies bored to the 4.600 and fitted with the 4 5/8 and 4 3/4 strokers without not much problem.
Needless to say I was not very happy when I received my New Paid in advance Merlin II Block almost a year later and marked on it was these numbers ; " 1.190 Ht." That made me further mad at them. I did get it sonic checked and we did end up putting a 4.600 bore in it but if it had been a nitrous engine I would have been scared of the bore.
The Merlin III Block is supposed to be very thick now. It is also supposed to be made of better material.
The Merlin Pro Block has rasied cam tunnels usually and has billet main caps. IT also has only the .842 Chevy lifter bores.
Comparing the Merlin Pro Block to the lower price ranged Dart Sportsman Big M or the Sportsman Billet cap block the Dart wins in my books. Plus Dart still has the Dart Race Block that is really nice.
Ed
Merlin II block was supposed to be a stronger aftermarket replacement for the Factory GM BowTie. At least it was when I ordered one.
Almost a year later when it was finally finished according to Merlin it would only accept the factory advertised max bore of 4.600 in extreme examples but would be ok at a 4.560 bore. Likewise according the Merlin (World Products) It might or might not be able to clear the 4 3/4 crank with grinding. What really made me mad was that at the time according to them that block should handle 900 to 1,000 hp.
I had already been exceeding that power level with factory production 454 blocks, so I was even more mad. By the time that block from Merlin was finally finished I had already had the Gen 5 and Gen 6 BowTies bored to the 4.600 and fitted with the 4 5/8 and 4 3/4 strokers without not much problem.
Needless to say I was not very happy when I received my New Paid in advance Merlin II Block almost a year later and marked on it was these numbers ; " 1.190 Ht." That made me further mad at them. I did get it sonic checked and we did end up putting a 4.600 bore in it but if it had been a nitrous engine I would have been scared of the bore.
The Merlin III Block is supposed to be very thick now. It is also supposed to be made of better material.
The Merlin Pro Block has rasied cam tunnels usually and has billet main caps. IT also has only the .842 Chevy lifter bores.
Comparing the Merlin Pro Block to the lower price ranged Dart Sportsman Big M or the Sportsman Billet cap block the Dart wins in my books. Plus Dart still has the Dart Race Block that is really nice.
Ed
