Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

We have one in shop right now and have looked it over and checked it for brinnel test and it seems to be a very soft block as it tested in the low 140's

To give you an idea a 010 block is around 180ish and SHP block tested mid 190's and the Little-M and Big-M are mid 230's because of the nickel content.

It lools like the block is finished honed and I have not probed it out for locations for deck heights, cylinder bore loctaions, lifter bore locations ETC.

Looks like once the cylinders were honed they decked the blocka nd left a burr at the top of the cylinder as there is a zero chamfer on the tops of the cylinders.

The lifter bores have a huge ridge at the top and on the bottom of the bores I would assume from machining the soft cast iron.

With that soft of bore it would wear the cylinders out in a short time as well as the lifter bores.

The rear main cap is not even flat where the pump sets on and they have welded what it looks like a insert where the threads are.

I will post pics later on and what we find for demensions in another thead.

For right now it does not look like a very high end peice and is surely a copy cat of the Dart Little-M block

I beleive PBM is selling them with their name on them!!

Are these blocks better or worse than a factory 400 4 bolt main?

x2 140? thats weaker than a standard block.Time to pay a visit....

I agree but you probably have more China crap than you care to believe. MADE IN AMERICA doesn't always mean it was MADE IN AMERICA.

FACT!

Only a %(I belive 60) of total cost OF THE PRODUCT including advertiseing to be called "MADE in the USA" :roll: :roll:

I worked for a company that had some stuff made in CHINA then unboxed it, washed it in a hot tank, stamped the part number on it with a pin stamp and "USA" and repacked it.

You know that's illegal right? The owners of the business can be fined and jailed by the US government for doing that.

By the same governmant that's lying to us by telling me my TAXES WANT GO UP to pay for all these wounderfull stimulus ideas?! Sad, but you are right!

Well, you can blame the 'sheeple' wanting 'change' for that. They're getting change, just not change for the better.

If you spend $40 to have a product made in china then ship it over.

then spend $60 to check it out repack and advertise it for sale at $150 ,It's made in the USA

I don't agree ,but thats what i read

It's called Foreign Trade. I fully understand we need to do some foreign trade and I agree it's a small world and we all need to work together and help each other, but all this is part of what's gotten us in this mess to begin with. We need to take care of ourselves FIRST. I agree, buy American, but that doesn't have the same meaning it did 25 years ago. The only way you can buy or help America(s) is to support your local businesses. Eventhough not all of their products will be "mad in the USA" you are helping put food on their table by spending $ with them.

Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

I agree too much is made in China, but that isn't the point here.

I disagree about the knockoff engine blocks from PBM. Currently I have 2 SBC's that I am using with these aftermarket blocks from PBM. My engine builder got them for me in a 4.155" bore. These were ready to assembled. Everything speced out perfect! These have proven to be a value beyond my expectations. I would be more interested in hearing the findings of an independent test. Even more surprising is the web page link listed isn't functioning? To anyone out there, I would use these blocks over again, and recommend them to anyone interested. I look forward to your comments.
:x :x

Re: Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

How long have you had the blocks?
How many miles or full passes are on the motors they are being used with?
Have you pulled the motors down since building and if so, what did the mains and cylinder bores look like?
How big of a cam were you using?
What did the lifter bores look like?
How high are you RPM'ing the motor?

All important things to take into consideration to say the least. Just because you threw it together and it fired up doesn't mean it's not junk.

Re: Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

My new website is under constuction as the gentlmen that designed mine is going through a devorce at this time a is no longer doing websites at this time.

What machines did you verify lifter bore and cylinder bore and cam tunnel locations with and son't tell me a vernier and what did the block brinell test at??

By the end of the week I should have some good photos and some reports on demensions.

Believe me those blocks are sent to Florida and a shop their is engraving PBM on the caps and blocks adding a stud kit line hone and finished machined.


The one we have the oil galley hole is to low int the bore and is not even square with the main line and you can see that by eye!!

I am sure you sonic tested right????????????

Re: Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

Speced out perfect on a CMM????? or with a rule?

Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

I got these blocks about 6 months ago. They are circle track 434ci engines. The first one has about 1000 laps or so on it and is running great. The second we build as a backup, and simply haven't had to use it. We had the pan off at about 800 laps, everything looked great. We change the oil and cut the filter every week. We simply haven't had any problems. Sounds like somebody doesn't like the new kid on the block.

Re: Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

Don't you work for Wheeler or tied in with them and sell those blocks and of coarse you say they are the best blocks out their.

And I beleive its Wheeler that is machining the blocks for PBM Correct???

I just received call from a shop that has a PBM block and on some of the outter splayed bolt holes some of them go right into the water jacket. And they are going to send me this block for inspection to see for sure if they are the same castings or not.

My name is Dick Boyer I am the director of sales and marketing for PBM performance Parts. I just wanted to clear up a few miss leading posts regarding our new PBM iron block. We at PBM strive to provide the engine builder with good quality engine parts and at no time would we knowingly sell something that had an issue in any way. So with all the allegations posted on this site I thought it best if you heard it from the people most resposible. We sent 3 blocks out to an independent metallurgical lab today to have a BHN test performed on them we sent a Bow tie GM block a Dart little M block and our new PBM iron block all of the blocks tested above 187 the PBM block tested 195. I also had a PBM block cut into sections to determine wall thickness and am sending a section of this block to an independent metallurgical lab to have a BHN test a rockwell test as well as a chemical analysis to determine the propertiies of the iron the block is made of the lab says this is the most accurate method. We here at PBM do not take lightly any idea that we would sell something that has issues of any type. If you have questions about this or any PBM products feel free to email me at [email protected] or call the PBM technical line at 800-588-9608

Your sales rep already called me today and said they had it tested and it was certified at 195 on the brinell testing. Interesting

I have not seen one of your blocks yet and have nothing to go by as far as brinell testing and from the discription of your block and the one I have here they seem very similar other then the main studs and valley screen.

Only time will tell if it arrives.

I know a shop that has a brand new PBM block sitting there waiting to be used he said it looks top notch and will know soon enough if it is or isnt :)

Interesting thread

Interesting as I have not seen a PBM block yet and the one I have there is no paper work no name no serial number but that one needs a ton of work just deburring the thing I guess I can call the block I have brand -X as I see they are all over EBAY and the internet for sale.

The shop that has them prob is one of the biggest PBM users out there, I asked him if he had read on the www about the soft blocks, he had not but said he was not worried as they (PBM) did a lot of research before sending them to anyone, and was not sure if the block tested was even a PBM. I assumed the one you had tested said PBM on it being you put their name on the bottom of the post, I am interested to hear the results when you do get one there.

Update on the block I have which came from my warehouse and this block we will call brand-X no name or paper work came with this block.

After measuring the mains which measured 2.6385 my centering rings are not going to work and the cam tunnel is 1.197 to 1.198 so my my adjustable fixture is not going to work in this block.

When I get time I will line hone the mains and make a plug for the cam tunnel.

I will get some pics and post later.

So when you got this no-name block from your warehouse, did the shipping paper say "Generic Block" and have no part number, or was there a description on the paperwork?

Just said engine block

Some pics of the Brand-X block I have.

The rear seal area of the block has no bevel which is required for the seal to fit properly with no leaks.
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...chinese001.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...chinese002.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...chinese003.jpg

So in your first post you're bashing this block & throwing PBM under the bus & now you say the block you have is not a PBM block & that you've never even seen a PBM block? Nice work. That sounds like slander in my book.

WTF can't you read as this is what I wrote, First time poster I see HMMMMMMMMM

Go to this forum on page 3 of this thread and argue with this guy as he has seen them both I have not seen the PBM block

http://www.yellowbullet.com/forum/sh...d.php?t=161360

Here is his quote

Re: Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

Carl, why even mention PBM? I think the people calling you out have a point.

Now I'm sure you will make a comment about how many times I have posted or not, but isn't it true that you make a habit out of starting threads like this one where you run down a product or someone elses work to make you look like some kind of hero.

Again Carl, why even throw PBM under the bus until you are 100% sure it is the same product? Why mention Wheeler in Florida?

It just doesn't show much class on your part.


Mark

I think if Hink wants to post an educated opinion on what a block may be that fine,but he dose say that he will call it block X.

It's funny that a bunch of frist time posters come out to defend a crappy block.

I'm not defending the block, it may well be complete crap; but Carl shouldn't have brought PBM & Wheeler into the discussion until he can say without a doubt that they are selling the same junk.

Have you read the Terms & Conditions of this Forum? To post you have to agree, in part, to not make Libelous and Defamatory statements
etc. etc.

Carl has insinuated that PBM is having Wheeler machine these low quality blocks and then passes them off as something better. Carl doesn't know if these statements are true but he goes ahead and throws them out there anyway.

I would bet Carl would be hopping mad if someone made libelous, slanderous and defamatory statements about his work product.


Mark

Re: Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

Read all my posts as i mention that I have net seen a PBM block yet, but if one shows up in my shop I will post pics of the PBM against the Brand-X block I have here now and this block has no name on it and came with no paper work saying who block it is.

And the block I have matches the ones I have seen on EBAY.

Again reread my posts

You maybe the one that came over to speedtalk to start some trouble and you didn't get far over there.

http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic...17747&start=90

carl, keep posting any testing results on this block you come up with. it seems like the defenders of this block all have a vested interest in it.

I talk to Dick Boyer yesterday and I told him a block was being sent to me to probe it out and I would not post the the results on the forums but would email him my findings and to the shop that is sending the block.

And by his response he seemd very interested in what I find as far as loctions and lifter bore angles ETC.

Again I have never seen a PBM block yet and I am pretty sure Wheeler is doing the machine work to the blocks and that is only here say but I have been told by enough high up people in this industry that know whats going on.

Re: Chinese look a like Little-M block
 

Carl,

I post on speedtalk, but haven't about this subject.

I have read & reread your post. I will quote you:

"I beleive PBM is selling them with there name on them!!"

Again I would ask, why slander PBM & Wheeler until you know for a fact that they are guilty of what you are accusing them of doing???