injection pumps

[qiksix]

Zip and others;
I have a hilborn injected chevy v6 and i can't get a good tune on it. It runs ok no missing or backfiring, best i've gone is 7.34 on the 1/8th.
After going through the system i found the pump is to large it's a 80A, was told it was a 1/2 pump when system was bought.
What size would you recommend.
Will a DSR/Waterman work aswell or should i stick with a hilborn/enderle.

[lively]

Zip and others;
I have a hilborn injected chevy v6 and i can't get a good tune on it. It runs ok no missing or backfiring, best i've gone is 7.34 on the 1/8th.
After going through the system i found the pump is to large it's a 80A, was told it was a 1/2 pump when system was bought.
What size would you recommend.
Will a DSR/Waterman work aswell or should i stick with a hilborn/enderle.

SWEEEEEET---PICS PLEASE :lol: :lol:
AND WHAT IS IT IN ?? MORE INFO 8) 8)

[bbchevy]

Zip and others;
I have a hilborn injected chevy v6 and i can't get a good tune on it. It runs ok no missing or backfiring, best i've gone is 7.34 on the 1/8th.
After going through the system i found the pump is to large it's a 80A, was told it was a 1/2 pump when system was bought.
What size would you recommend.
Will a DSR/Waterman work aswell or should i stick with a hilborn/enderle.

A Brand is just that,a Brand!

A 80A could be anything from about 3.8 to around 5 gal.?Does it have any Other mark after the 80A?
That Pump is about as SMALL as it Gets!

A ZERO is What you Need!
But,with a Larger Pump?You just RETURN More than you Consume!

Hope that HELPS!

Later
G 8)

[qiksix]

It turned out the pump is a 80A-1, i get to return more, but i feel it's losing to much pressure aswell and maybe contributing to bad throttle responce and a rich idle smell, even with shutoff pulled more than 1/2 way. I've even leak tested the high speed to a safe 70psi and i don't think it's opening yet, relatively new engine and rpm's are only 6500 so far.
Have seen guy's run 80A-1 on 8 cyl. but i think my v6 is too small to pull the pump back or i'm doing something wrong.
I was thinking the 0 pump also or one similar size.

Hey lively i'll try and upload some pics, it's in a aussie torana.

[lively]

i do like hilborn injectors --it is just different 8)

[zipper06]

Need more imformation, Alcohol, gas, nozzle size, inlet line size to pump, weight of car,i can tell you that i'm a DSR person, i've known Daryl for 12/13 yrs since he lived in memphis, but also have Enderle pumps in the larger size for the blower motor and big blk injected. I think a DSR "0" pump would be my choice. I like the DSR because it has a manifold with 3 outlets on it. leak down setting also makes a lot of difference in throttle response especially in the first 60'.
Also i donot like the loop line setup in case you're running one, also the -1 is way too big, that's more like a big blk pump.
You have to buy a new pump, call DSR/Daryl and ask him what size he would recommend, he can also rebuild/change your pump to the necessary size for a couple hundred dollars. The DSR and Enderle pump are all the same size in the 80a and DSR. They just change the gears out to shorter or longer to increase the size and use hardened steel shims to make up the difference. Tell Daryl that John Allen from La. sent you, but then again he might charge you double :lol:
Zip.

[qiksix]

Hey Zip you helped me out a while back when i first got it going.
Here goes, i haven't leak tested anything for while so they might not be exact;
alcohol fuel, kinsler p510(12) nozzles, barrel valve 25%?, secondary 8psi ?, highspeed 70psi, -10 inlet and -6 everywhere else, -6 breather.
Haven't actually weighed the car but i think it's around 2600lbs near street trim.
I've had to find a happy medium with the b/v, too rich it seems to slow and too lean it squeaks through the stacks, that was an interesting diagnosis thought it was in the engine. Took your advice on the theory of footbrake racing.

[zipper06]

I don't remember how big the injectors are, but i'm thinking you said 2 3/8 or 2 7/16" stacks. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say the nozzles are also too small, if that's a V6 90* around or over 300"s I would definately have min. #16 nozzles, but would prefer #18's on that size bore. I also think that you have a problem with the pump, if it's not blowing by the HS set at 70lbs by the time you hit 5500/6000 rpm's it sounds weak. On the nozzles #12's are the high end for gas and the very lowest end for alcohol. We run 18's on any bore over 4" in a sm/blk and 16's on the 305 sprinter engines with 2 3/16" stacks. The barrel valve is real close @25%. A weak pump could also explain why it seems so rich on the bottom end and why it won't rpm on high end.
A car with that weight could easley run mid to low 6's in the 1/8 mi. with 1.30's 60' times.

JMO

Zip.

[qiksix]

Stacks are 2 3/16, 4.04 bore 268ci. I did ask Don at hilborn about nozzle size and said #12's, the more i look at other sbc injectors the more i think your right with 16-18s on that size bore, unless Don was thinking 12s cause of the smaller injector size. It's basicly a sbc less 2 cyls. brodix -11 heads comp cam [email protected] .650 [email protected] .632 106l/s. I''m only turning it to 6500 at the moment cause of the std cast crank, can't justify 3k for billet at this stage. I'll start with the pump and i might look at trying a set of nozzles.

[bbchevy]

Stacks are 2 3/16, 4.04 bore 268ci. I did ask Don at hilborn about nozzle size and said #12's, the more i look at other sbc injectors the more i think your right with 16-18s on that size bore, unless Don was thinking 12s cause of the smaller injector size. It's basicly a sbc less 2 cyls. brodix -11 heads comp cam [email protected] .650 [email protected] .632 106l/s. I''m only turning it to 6500 at the moment cause of the std cast crank, can't justify 3k for billet at this stage. I'll start with the pump and i might look at trying a set of nozzles.

I BET hes got the INFO Wrong!!!
#12's for GASOLINE,....I come up with #18 for methenol!!!

Later
G 8)

[zipper06]

About 3 yrs ago a guy Suicide Bomb, (Earl Follet) Pm'ed me for help with his injection 2 3/16" stacks, he had a rebuilt pump. The first thing i did was have him change to #18 nozzles, and then we worked thru the tuneup, his best run 10.22@124mph, his car is a Fiat Altered, less than 2,000 lbs, before the season was over he ran 9.08 @ 143 mph, that with a 406" on alcohol, he had #14's in the motor in the beginning. Now grant it he did lot's of other issues, besides the nozzles.

Now Don Enreques is a very competent tuner, one of the best i know and the only person i deal with at Hilborn, he also runs a nastalga front engine
dragster with stacks sm/blk chevy and is one of a very few people that runs over 200 mph in the class. Like BBchevy says i think also he misunderstood the imfo.

Zip.

[TheYellaBrick]

Speaking of Suicide, he's one of our MIA's......

:( :( :( :(

[qiksix]

So Zip would you say i try 16s or 18s, after i get a new pump.

[zipper06]

So Zip would you say i try 16s or 18s, after i get a new pump.
are your nozzles on the inside of the injectors or the outside like the old injection setup? If they are on the inside shooting straight into the cylinder heads, i have a set of 16AS 3 1/2" long that you can have for $150.00, course you'd be getting 2 extra's for free. They are straight nozzles not 90* hose connections. They are used but like new with screens and all, or if you want PM and we can talk about it, they are about $280.00 new or more.

Zip.

[zipper06]

Speaking of Suicide, he's one of our MIA's......

:( :( :( :(

Not MIA, DD he got booted by BJ about 1 1/2 yrs ago for taking up for CP/Charlie when CP got into a pi$$ing contest with BJ over something stupid, but in reality CP is an instigator (even at the track) and i personally know both of them. I talk to Suicide Bomb every coupleweeks or his wife. That's one of the reasons i almost never get into pi$$ing contest.
I could have got into one with the 69 Camero VS 55 Chevy, because i sold a 55 on ebay about 3 yrs ago for $37,500.00 and pissed off 2 people because i pulled the ad 1 1/2 days before it expired, because someone within 40 miles of me pm'ed me with an offer with cash in hand. The bid was up to $36,000.00 at the time, i can tell you it would have taken a 69 RS COPO to even be consided for a trade. The 2 guys that got pi$$ed were waiting for a last minute dash and got caught with their pants down. It was Barret and Jackson quality we thought about taking it to Fla. for their auction. Wea lso just bought a 69 Camero painted and with $3500.00 worth of new interior #'s matching 350 rust free for $10,500.00. it was a no brainer. I know where there is a 55 chevy rust free roller for $4,000.00, but it cost 2 times as much to build a 55 as it does a Camero.

Zip.

[cbtlr]

Speaking of Suicide, he's one of our MIA's......

:( :( :( :(

Not MIA, DD he got booted by BJ about 1 1/2 yrs ago for taking up for CP/Charlie when CP got into a pi$$ing contest with BJ over something stupid, but in reality CP is an instigator (even at the track) and i personally know both of them. I talk to Suicide Bomb every coupleweeks or his wife. That's one of the reasons i almost never get into pi$$ing contest.
I could have got into one with the 69 Camero VS 55 Chevy, because i sold a 55 on ebay about 3 yrs ago for $37,500.00 and pissed off 2 people because i pulled the ad 1 1/2 days before it expired, because someone within 40 miles of me pm'ed me with an offer with cash in hand. The bid was up to $36,000.00 at the time, i can tell you it would have taken a 69 RS COPO to even be consided for a trade. The 2 guys that got pi$$ed were waiting for a last minute dash and got caught with their pants down. It was Barret and Jackson quality we thought about taking it to Fla. for their auction. Wea lso just bought a 69 Camero painted and with $3500.00 worth of new interior #'s matching 350 rust free for $10,500.00. it was a no brainer. I know where there is a 55 chevy rust free roller for $4,000.00, but it cost 2 times as much to build a 55 as it does a Camero.

Zip.I beg to differ I know Charlie on a personal level.I live in Calif I ventured to Bartlett Tenn to meet Charlie on two different occasions.Each visit we took his 69 to Byhalia and Holly Springs.Charles was very cool to say the least.The other racers enjoyed Charlies company at the track from what I could see.I didnt see any bad blood between Charles and the other racers. On a forum you might not really now the member on a personal level.I do and have no bad words against Charles.Stand up guy from what I know of him in over 6 years.I highly doubt Zip you know Charles at my level with him.Not standing up for Charlie just speaking REAL TALK!!!!!
If you like we can discuss this over a pm over my reply to this thread..

[olds48]

Suicide Bomb got banned?! Man,he was always so kind to me. I have been away from here for a while and have been trying to find Earl. That sucks :cry:

[roadkill2]

Now Don Enreques is a very competent tuner, one of the best i know and the only person i deal with at Hilborn, he also runs a nastalga front engine
dragster with stacks sm/blk chevy and is one of a very few people that runs over 200 mph in the class. Like BBchevy says i think also he misunderstood the imfo.

Zip.

There's hardly anybody in the whole world that knows more about normally aspirated Mechanical Fuel Injection than Don Enriques (Maybe Gene Snow) so what ever he tells you, unless he didn't have enough information, is generally right on the nuts . . Raced a Jr. Fueler back in the late 60's and they (Gene Adams and Don) had the benchmark car (A "Roy Car' with a little 300" De Soto Hemi in it) . . we all were running 7.10s and they were running 6.90s . . . And that's back when your dial in in Comp was the Nat'l record . . made things awful tough for us dumber guys . . .