The 511 died Today

[bjuice]

Positive 1st...got the vette chassis set up last week by Alan Pittman,he let me work along side him and ohh how much did i learn on a chassis set up..

bad News--- i took the camaro to the track today to get 4 or 5 passes in to knock off the rust before i jump in the vette the next few weeks..

the car seemed a little sluggish on the warm up..but since i had just put the GAS carb back on i thought i was feeling the difference of the GAS vs ALCOHOL......

i pulled to the starting line did my burn out..staged and left....i had the two step turned back from 4200rpm to 3600rpm..trying to prevent a wheel stand like my last trip to the track.....i knew i left soft but the car never came around down track like it normally does...NO POPPING,SPITTING OR SPUTTING...just felt sluggish...i went thru the traps at a 6.49 et at 105 mph. ET was off by 6 tenths and mile per hour was off 11 to 12 mph.....60 ft went from a 1.31 to a 1.42

got back to the pitts and pulled off valve covers..push rod was missing on the intake of #1 cylinder....

got it home about one hour ago and pulled intake..push rod was broke in half and the end splintered off one side..at closer glance the cam lobe on the #1 exhaust looked like it had been hit with a chiesel ( i assume the missing push rod end did this)..i could not pull out #1 lifters..so i do not know at this point the extent of damage to block..could be a bur but i am not holding my breath..

i am running over in my mind what could have happened..

#1- push rod failure ( attrition)..
#2- lifter failure
#3- oiling problem which caused lifter failure

the push rods were CV.....

i am leaning toward lifter failure caused there is a slight bend in the push rod as you piece it back together...

deciding now what i am gonna do here....i know i am gonna use the heads,intake,oil pan..and crank if it checks out......leaning right now toward a 565ci shortblock with dart big "m" block..

this block was .125 over stock block (2 BOLT)..and it had the hound snot ran out of it.....

any thoughts as to what may have happened ?


ps..one postive thing about the pass..i did almost have a perfect light
a -001 RED..... :oops:

[lanham]

Sorry to hear the bad news hopefully the rest of the parts aren't hurt.

[Oldewalnut]

It sucks when you lunch one. That's the one thing about this I fear. Unless you have alot of spare money, parts or, best case, complete motors. A catostropic failure can set you back for a goodly amount of time.

Just hope you can salvage some of the parts. Just from your description, sounds like a lack of oiling. Did the lifter sieze in it's bore? When pushrods bend and/or break, they can do some nasty things. That's another thought, was the pushrod itself oiling, or might it have clogged.

If the motor had alot of use as you alluded to. It might have just been a parts time to fail.

[bjuice]

It sucks when you lunch one. That's the one thing about this I fear. Unless you have alot of spare money, parts or, best case, complete motors. A catostropic failure can set you back for a goodly amount of time.

Just hope you can salvage some of the parts. Just from your description, sounds like a lack of oiling. Did the lifter sieze in it's bore? When pushrods bend and/or break, they can do some nasty things. That's another thought, was the pushrod itself oiling, or might it have clogged.

If the motor had alot of use as you alluded to. It might have just been a parts time to fail.

everything you mentioned could have been the culprit..at this point i am not 100% sure..the signs are pointing toward a seized lifter simpley for the fact i cannot pull the set out..also the slight bend in the rod itself tells me there was unusal amount of resisitance on that rod..the knurling of the cam lobe had to come for the sharpnel from the push rod end.

u are right this is something all racers face each time they go out...i take care of my stuff,more than called for oil changes,frequent valve adjustments,,new springs each season...and i still got stuck with this deal

i spoke with PAR begining of this year and i know worse case he can use my heads with a complete new 565 botttom end for around 6k...if i can use my crank and i want to ( callies stealth) my oil pan,gear drive,head studs, balancer...it should knock 2k off.....

what i know i am gonna use or need. is a new Block ( Big "m') even if the old one could be line bored and saved..its a .125 over stock block..its gotta be tired...new cam,lifters,Rods,Pistons,bearings..

i hate i lost the 511 today cause it really ran like a "bat out of hell" for what it was....on motor in a car close to 3100lbs it ran mid 5.90's on the back bumper...had 70's in it all day long...you expect to hear these stock blocks coming apart at .125 over...but this one was good....with a 200 shot i am sure the thing would have run some 5.40's ....

gonna take off heads tommorrow,then yanks it all the way out the next day..i need the few days to think out my best route

[bowtie4542001]

Brian,
Sorry to hear about the Camaro, I wish you the best of luck deciding what to do. If you need help, give me a hollar. Let us know what you find.

Chris

[bjuice]

update :

got lifter out and what happened was a lifter malfuntion...IT KNOCKED THE ROLLER OFF THE LIFTER...

Funny thing is that the roller lifter that lost the ball ( exhaust) was NOT the pushrod the broke..it broke the intake push rod beside it...

Ohh well.. although it stinks..what can be done ?...but fix the problem..right >>....

looks like a 565ci is in the works.....

[topsportsman1]

Sorry to hear this Brian,hope you get it fixed back up.

[lookingaround]

sorry to hear about your luck brian. on a positive note you get a bigger motor.

[Tod74]

I lost a fresh 454 (30 over) once when a roller lifter broke. cracked the block in the cam tunnel....sucks. Mine the wheel was in two pieces and the link bar was broken and obviously the lifters went sideways destroying the cam....pumped all that crap through the bearings because I didn't have the bypass plugged....mine was a 512 casting 1970 block. What a waste. Still have it but afraid to use it...was told I could do a partial fill to keep crack from leaking but never did.

[mikeaton]

ouch!!!!! i feel your pain! good luck with the new bullet ! mike

[topfool]

R.I.P. the 511's..

mine died too ...

mind you it ran 8.00 @165 (5.00--1/8th) before I found a crack in it, well another crack that I didnt wqant to ignore..

I wanted a 7 but will take the 8.00...

[lotsof454sss]

Well juice looks like you got to bite the bullet but look back at all the good times the 511 supplied you and look ahead at all your going to gain and really not all that much $$ to go bigger and better as you always do..HAHA..Sorry to hear it though but good luck and keep us posted on the happenings..I am still just sitting still here..Buying a few parts along for the future...

[bjuice]

Perry your right...was a strong motor..for a little big block..i am gonna look closley at the collateral damage when i get everthing tore down..if nothing too serious anyhwere else i will put it back together..for a spare or put it in the wifes 69 camaro...teee heeeee......


Sam that was some aweful good ET'S to run outta that little motor..i did not realize you had a 511 ??


we will gfet the game plan together as we go...i am working a little at a time to get the motor out...getting back to the vette..i am close to my 1st shake down in the vette...going over all the nuts and bolts one more time...gettting ansy...here are a few pics of both cars this weekend ( Saturday)..i broke the camaro the next day... :cry:

played with the vette in the drive way...sucked my peanuts up on the ole bung-um hole....she is gonna pull........just getting use to where everything is for obvious reasons...lol



http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb117/brianmcswain/100_0422.jpg


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http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb117/brianmcswain/100_0421.jpg

[topfool]

Brian, The car had a 511 in when I bought it, I changed the heads when I dropped a valve (big over rev) but basically its the same engine god know how many runs it had on it... but I've not even put rings or bearings in it....

I'll try and find another block sometime to build it as a spare.. but as soon as I get my new shop built I'll start building the 540, KB olds block, callies crank, oliver billet rods, 15:1 je and my brodix -3Xtra oval ports... I'll start it on the carb and gas but probably go injected alky sometime... I do have a box of 11.5 :1 coated pistons thatwould be nice to use up if I had a blower, mind you injected nitro sounds good too...

Be lucky with that vette...

[qtrmile2]

Hey Brian,
Sorry to hear about the motor in the Camaro. Your safe and that's all that matters.
Good luck with the Vette this summer. Can't wait to hear some ET numbers. Do you know when your gunna make some shake down runs?

[bjuice]

Hey Brian,
Sorry to hear about the motor in the Camaro. Your safe and that's all that matters.
Good luck with the Vette this summer. Can't wait to hear some ET numbers. Do you know when your gunna make some shake down runs?

renting one our our local tracks Thursday after next..we have about 5 hours for solo passes before the track opens for thursday night test and tune..

the vette has a real tight NOS converter..should NOT 60FT like it would with a little NOS lossening up the converter or a all motor..i expect to leave 3 or more tenths on the table with the current converter..my chassis guy has already told me that the wheel speed with the tight converter on the big end may cause the car to move around a bit more than a loser converter resulting in a little more driving of the car however i am leaving the converter alone i expect to it hit with a 200/250 shot once i get the feel for the car...

below is a pic i took of it tonight after adjusting wheelie bars....


also i pic of the 511 lifter valley whowing the broke wheel off lifter...ouchhhh :shock:








http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb117/brianmcswain/100_0436.jpg


[/img]http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb117/brianmcswain/100_0437.jpg

[Oldewalnut]

Hey juice, I'll second that ouch!!!

I lunched a 289 Ford, D/MP motor in the late 70's. Rod twisted, piston siezed and took out a piece of the bore and the lifter valley. Amazing part was, the front 2-3 lobes of the cam and the timing chain were intact, drove the car back to the pits. Wasn't much left to salvage from that motor.