help with sbc 406 - 434

[bowler]

I have a Donovan 350 aluminum block 400 mains fresh 4.15 bore, problem is the block is decked 180.000? what would be my best option for 406-421-434? will 5.85 rod work? with what piston? would like 13 to 1 gas no nos, heads are AFR 227 100% factory ported, car will be 2200-2300#, 456 gear, 32 1/2" tall tire, 176 PG w/ 5000 stall. thanks for the help: BOWLER

[us7race]

So is your deck height now 8.845?
If so this motor could use a 5.85 rod and 3.75 stroke if you can find a piston with a compression height of 1.12 for whatever bore it is.
I miscalculated in my earlier post. Sorry. :oops:

[bowler]

the guy i got the block from had napa do the machine work on the block, he was building a 406 with 6"rods went to assemble it and thats how they found out it had been decked (180 thousants napa said) block had been used in a sprint car. i am going by what the machine told him. hope this helps thanks Bowler

[hammertime]

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.

[us7race]

Sorry :oops: reread my previous post..

[gimmemud]

I have a like new set of Lunati Pro Mod Steel rods 5.850 if they would work I will make you a sweet deal on them.

[floritejoe]

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.


I have a 427 SBC 13.7:1 with a big 8000+rpm roller and AFR 227 heads...The engine has been 9.6-9.8 @ 139 @ 3400lbs, I think AFR 227 heads are enough head for a big SBC.

Just my 2.5 cents

[Tod74]

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.


I have a 427 SBC 13.7:1 with a big 8000+rpm roller and AFR 227 heads...The engine has been 9.6-9.8 @ 139 @ 3400lbs, I think AFR 227 heads are enough head for a big SBC.

Just my 2.5 cents

should be between 720-750 hp

[hammertime]

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.


I have a 427 SBC 13.7:1 with a big 8000+rpm roller and AFR 227 heads...The engine has been 9.6-9.8 @ 139 @ 3400lbs, I think AFR 227 heads are enough head for a big SBC.

Just my 2.5 cents

Just think how good it'd run with the proper heads :P Bigger CI SB motors need better heads to work like they are capable of is what I am saying. I've had the afr 227's on a 434 ran good but surely would of ran a heck of a lot better with a better head.

[floritejoe]

What do you consider a better head (without going to a raised runner or non-23 degree set-up? Just curious what you have used that runs better than 227AFRs on a 427+SBC?.... Thanks.

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.


I have a 427 SBC 13.7:1 with a big 8000+rpm roller and AFR 227 heads...The engine has been 9.6-9.8 @ 139 @ 3400lbs, I think AFR 227 heads are enough head for a big SBC.

Just my 2.5 cents

Just think how good it'd run with the proper heads :P Bigger CI SB motors need better heads to work like they are capable of is what I am saying. I've had the afr 227's on a 434 ran good but surely would of ran a heck of a lot better with a better head.

[hammertime]

What do you consider a better head (without going to a raised runner or non-23 degree set-up? Just curious what you have used that runs better than 227AFRs on a 427+SBC?.... Thanks.

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.


I have a 427 SBC 13.7:1 with a big 8000+rpm roller and AFR 227 heads...The engine has been 9.6-9.8 @ 139 @ 3400lbs, I think AFR 227 heads are enough head for a big SBC.

Just my 2.5 cents

Just think how good it'd run with the proper heads :P Bigger CI SB motors need better heads to work like they are capable of is what I am saying. I've had the afr 227's on a 434 ran good but surely would of ran a heck of a lot better with a better head.

Best 23 degree head All-Pro do take some special stuff though. I was simply saying that a 406 can be made to work darn close to a bigger inch sb with afr 227's. Thats been proved several times. Best head for a bigger inch sb is sb2, 12,15,18 degree no doubt about it. Its amazing the hp/tq gain when the proper head is used on these monsters.

[floritejoe]

What do you consider a better head (without going to a raised runner or non-23 degree set-up? Just curious what you have used that runs better than 227AFRs on a 427+SBC?.... Thanks.

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.


I have a 427 SBC 13.7:1 with a big 8000+rpm roller and AFR 227 heads...The engine has been 9.6-9.8 @ 139 @ 3400lbs, I think AFR 227 heads are enough head for a big SBC.

Just my 2.5 cents

Just think how good it'd run with the proper heads :P Bigger CI SB motors need better heads to work like they are capable of is what I am saying. I've had the afr 227's on a 434 ran good but surely would of ran a heck of a lot better with a better head.

Best 23 degree head All-Pro do take some special stuff though. I was simply saying that a 406 can be made to work darn close to a bigger inch sb with afr 227's. Thats been proved several times. Best head for a bigger inch sb is sb2, 12,15,18 degree no doubt about it. Its amazing the hp/tq gain when the proper head is used on these monsters.

Ahhhh, YES, I thought we were comparing apples to apples. No doubt a SB2 or 12,15,18 deg will make MUCH more power. All it takes to make more power is more money eh?

[hammertime]

What do you consider a better head (without going to a raised runner or non-23 degree set-up? Just curious what you have used that runs better than 227AFRs on a 427+SBC?.... Thanks.

406 AFR 227's are not enough head to make a bigger inch small block work @ its peak. I've been this route.


I have a 427 SBC 13.7:1 with a big 8000+rpm roller and AFR 227 heads...The engine has been 9.6-9.8 @ 139 @ 3400lbs, I think AFR 227 heads are enough head for a big SBC.

Just my 2.5 cents

Just think how good it'd run with the proper heads :P Bigger CI SB motors need better heads to work like they are capable of is what I am saying. I've had the afr 227's on a 434 ran good but surely would of ran a heck of a lot better with a better head.

Best 23 degree head All-Pro do take some special stuff though. I was simply saying that a 406 can be made to work darn close to a bigger inch sb with afr 227's. Thats been proved several times. Best head for a bigger inch sb is sb2, 12,15,18 degree no doubt about it. Its amazing the hp/tq gain when the proper head is used on these monsters.

Ahhhh, YES, I thought we were comparing apples to apples. No doubt a SB2 or 12,15,18 deg will make MUCH more power. All it takes to make more power is more money eh?

Seems everything takes more money anymore lol :lol:

[jmarksdragster]

Build a 421, use 5.7 rods and IGNORE what anyone says about rod ratio. This will give you a more stable piston/pin height. My brother runs one with 867 RR Pontiac heads, not as good as your AFR's, has run 5.61 1/8 (not run yet in the 1/4 but about 8.80's) in a 1900 lb SG Corvette roadster. With a 5000 stall, limit the intake duration to around [email protected], should still run low 9's in the 1/4.

[maxpower671]

Floritejoe, that's impressive power you are making with those AFR 227's! what kind of fuel are you burning? how much additional work to those heads? are you using giggle juice too? how big is that roller? once again, very nice! inquiring minds want to know..

[altune]

HOLD ON NOW,
the pontiac 867 casting is a good casting.
Depending on whats been done.
I have a set I had redone by Self racing that will flow 360 cfm at .800 on intake and make some impressive power.
these have their port intruders in them.
yer best bang per buck has to be their 18* clone cnc ported setup.
they are oval port, brodix heads with Self racings CNC program.
they flow on intake @.700 aprox. 420 cfm
so capable of 900-950 hp out of a small block
cost with good springs, valves etc. $3400 ASSEMBLED.
VERY GOOD DEAL!
Put those on a stout 434 and a good cam and go racing !

[bowler]

thanks for the info, i sold my 434, i'am looking for heads now. called afr for 227 comp. ported spread port heads, not avalible till june 08. would like 23* heads but i'am looking at 18* i'am building a 40 willys roadster tube chassis all glass body, 22-2300# with driver and i want to run mid to low 9's. still don't know what cu. in., crank, rods, pistons, to build this donovan. thanks again Doug

[zipper06]

thanks for the info, i sold my 434, i'am looking for heads now. called afr for 227 comp. ported spread port heads, not avalible till june 08. would like 23* heads but i'am looking at 18* i'am building a 40 willys roadster tube chassis all glass body, 22-2300# with driver and i want to run mid to low 9's. still don't know what cu. in., crank, rods, pistons, to build this donovan. thanks again Doug

Hey doug, how you doing? By the way the Zoomies you sent me for my Anglia clear the chassis just fine.


But back to the question, i think with the block decked that much the biggest crank you'll be able to fit is a 3 3/4" (AKA-406" stroke) The bigger problem i see is the intake manifold, no matter what heads you choose. I think you're going to be stuck useing a fab manifold or a 3 piece stacks injection unit on that block.
The low 9's is easily reached with a 406" at 2200lbs. A friend of mine is running 9.20's in a shoebox 55 chevy @ 2650lbs with a 394" and 23 degree heads an alcohol.

Zip.

[bowler]

zip glad to here from you, the zoomies need to be narrowed? i'am sure 406 is big enough for what i want to do. i have a gas 1050 dominator afr says their runner is raised 3/16" so i hope i can mill an intake to fit?thanks for the info Doug

[jmarksdragster]

HOLD ON NOW,
the pontiac 867 casting is a good casting.
Depending on whats been done.
I have a set I had redone by Self racing that will flow 360 cfm at .800 on intake and make some impressive power.
these have their port intruders in them.
yer best bang per buck has to be their 18* clone cnc ported setup.
they are oval port, brodix heads with Self racings CNC program.
they flow on intake @.700 aprox. 420 cfm
so capable of 900-950 hp out of a small block
cost with good springs, valves etc. $3400 ASSEMBLED.
VERY GOOD DEAL!
Put those on a stout 434 and a good cam and go racing !

These are old 867's without offset rockers, only flowed high 290's. Same heads on a 406 in a 2600 lb Malibu ran 9.70's, 9.59 best. A 406 or 421 will cover what you want with those heads, a decent roller cam, and still keep the RPM's under 7500.

[zipper06]

zip glad to here from you, the zoomies need to be narrowed? i'am sure 406 is big enough for what i want to do. i have a gas 1050 dominator afr says their runner is raised 3/16" so i hope i can mill an intake to fit?thanks for the info Doug

The zoomies donot need to be narrowed, but i may have to cut off the up-turns, due to the fact they will stick out of the body lines more than they did on your 34 willy's. I guess they will be called weed cutters then :P

Zip.

[floritejoe]

Floritejoe, that's impressive power you are making with those AFR 227's! what kind of fuel are you burning? how much additional work to those heads? are you using giggle juice too? how big is that roller? once again, very nice! inquiring minds want to know..

Running Alcohol, but switching over to gas this season. No additional work done to the CNC comp ported AFR 227 heads. No juice, but I just bought a kit that I will try this year to compensate for the fuel switch power loss. It's a big roller with over 750 lift and [email protected]

[Gdaddy]

My 434 with 11x heads with a 1050 dominator small roller runs 5.70s and 5.80s and 8.90s @ 2850 lbs in an all steel camaro

[ima400]

i cant see why a 406 with 227 cc heads wont work . ive got a 414 with these heads , made 675 hp on dyno , run's 9.26 @ 143 mph in a 2780 pond car