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Thread: going large

  1. #1
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    going large

    Hi all, was looking for advice on going to a bigger motor. I currenty have a 502 gm dart 345's dart intake 10:1 pump gas motor with nitrous in my 67 camaro stock front chassis. Car has gone 10.30's on gas and has run a 9.23 w/400 shot. I was wanting to upgrade to a 582 short deck to keep things simple but was thinking if I am going large why not go all the way. This means of course a tall deck motor. Found out Lemons says they do make headers that will work with a tall deck block with a conventional head and a big chief head in the 67-69 camaros. I don't know about putting a big chief head on this car, could be asking for more fitment issues. I don't have a lot of room with the set up I have now. I don't have any power steering/brakes or any accessories, so I am thinking this could be done with the conventional head. Should I go 622 or 632 or? What head? dart 385cc? What about the 18 degree heads from dart that you can use all the conventional parts with? Suppose to be good for about 50 hp over a 24 degree head. Want to go about 11:1 for compression for this limited street strip car.

    Shaffirof has a 632/900 and a 632/1000hp big chief Ultra street motor. Anyone recommend these ultra street engines? Anybody here that has put a tall deck motor in a 67-69 camaro stock front chassis? Oh, I have the big cowl hood. I am tempted to get the 632/900 motor just don't know if I am asking for trouble. Surely someone here has done this. Thanks for any advice...

  2. #2
    Senior Member DYNO OPERATOR
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    First thing welcome to the forums an Racing Junk. Now this is JMO if you are working on a budget for sure go with the 582 cid that will make life easy. If your not on a budget then go with the 632 cid and be ready for a lot of shop work and things to happen that you did not fore see in your install because it will happen. Hope that helps.
    Wesley
    60' 1.30
    5.58 @ 127.89

  3. #3
    Senior Member RACING JUNKIE
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    Dont give up this keep checking, these things usually take a few days to get going and its raceday tomorrow so hang in there.
    I've never personally done what your asking so I cant give you any of the info you are looking for. I'm currently building a 496 for my 69 camaro tube chassis dragcar its my first venture with a stroker motor and its been expensive and slow going due to my budget restrictions and this deep south heat wave. Sounds like you have deep pockets so I'd go for the 1000hp 632 but I think that shaffirof has had missed reviews here if I'm not mistaken, so be cautious. I'm sure you'll be enlightened either way. We tend to be a opinionated bunch, but we mean well. Welcome to the forum and Goodluck, Charles
    ***IN GOD WE TRUST***

  4. #4
    Senior Member DYNO OPERATOR
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    hi, seems like all good reviews from reher-morrison r.e. ,if you want a big motor, talk to them!! my thoughts!!!! David.

  5. #5

    engine

    Check out Ohio Crankshaft they have a complete 620 for $10,000.

  6. #6
    Administrator RACING JUNKIE bjuice's Avatar
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    Hello Doubler ..what part of the country you from ?..this will help us pair you up with the best engine builder..
    i can already tell you some of the ELITE group that you can bank on Getting your $$ worth.
    Texas area- Rhear Morrison
    Alabama Area- Eagle Race Engines- They use to build ex-Pro mod Scotty Cannons motor's after the Fulton/Cannon fall out years ago.
    Northern/Southern EAST coast- PAR racing engines.AWESOME !!...the owner is Scott Duggins....Or FULTON RACE ENGINES..Gene Fulton is the man AND HAS BEEN FOR YEARS but i feel 120% you can get the same quality and performance motor from PAR a few grand cheaper....IN MY OPINION a man is paying a little for the FULTON NAME these days and PROBABLY RIGHTFULLY SO..Gene has earned that right

    these 4 engine builders could service you from Middle USA back to East coast...YOU ALMOST NEVER HEAR ANY NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ABOUT THEM.

    i WOULD BE VERY CAREFUL With Anyone else..obviously if your looking at a 632ci your funds will allow you to be a little more choosy..
    if i can help you with Fulton or Par telephone # please let me know.

    Brian
    Bjuice..

    "I'M YOUR HUCKLEBERRY ! "

  7. #7
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    Thanks for the welcome and cepx111 I do have a budget. But when I look at what I get from GM 572 for around 12-13k and then I look at what I can get with quality parts for a few thousand more it's worth it in the long run. I want a good crank and rods and gotta have some jesels or T&D's. They have made a few improvements over the years. The good stuff cost a certain amount and I am not willing to cut to many corners. If I can upgrade the rods to the Olivers on this build and keep it around my budget I will try. I figure or am willing to spend around 20k plus or minus a couple to get what I want. Besides, I keep breaking this 502 so if you count my labor I should have done this a while back! I want one of these motor that I keep hearing about that all you have to do is check the valves a couple of times and change the oil after 300 runs. I can get a deal on a Schmidt 632 nitrous motor for 35k but that is out of my range. And after just getting back from Hot August Nights, now that is some serious bling on some of those cars!

    Bjuice, I am in the northwest part of the country but I did send my heads and intake in last winter to RM and bought a 7/4 cam and crower rollers. When I did talk to them about building a lower compression type motor for the "street" they said I couldn't do much better than what I had. They did say they would build me what I want but I didn't get a good feeling about it. It seemed liked they had there super series combo and weren't really into a custom motor. But I got a flyer from them and they are building street motors now so I was going to talk to them again. They are on my list of engine builders to talk to. My main concern is to find some one that as installed a tall deck motor in a 67 camaro and used a good size header. If I can find out this is possible I think I am going to go big!

    Has anyone heard of stroker engines in California? He has a pretty good deal on a 620/900 hp 10/5 motor. http://www.strokerengine.com/BBC620.html
    Looks like all good parts in it. What do you guys think of the 2 632 motors on Shaffirof site? I know that he has good and bad reviews here but was wondering about his combos...what do you think about the big chief heads for the "street"? I thought those heads were for upper rpm but I looked at the dyno sheet on their motor it was 6500 max. I would attach it but don't see how to do it...

  8. #8
    Administrator RACING JUNKIE bjuice's Avatar
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    i have studied the SSRE site for a long time and have been very tempted in the past...but due to the feed back (neg) i have read..i personally DO NOT feel 100% comfortable for the amount of money you are looking at spending..Plus at the price they are selling their stuff you cannot be getting any custom work..they are templating these motors and shipping them out...they have to do this in order to sell so cheap....do not get me wrong i feel 100% you are getting good parts etc..but its being slapped together and wherever the tolerances fall thats where it is..

    My cousin purchased a 565ci PAR motor last year and he has over 300 passes on this motor and doesn't do anything but change the oil..he hasn't even changed plugs in the thing all year long ( against my judgement).....he runs a bracket series every Friday and Saturday night,,round after round,after round...His car weighs 3100 with him in it and runs 5.60's all day long with a low et of 5.58...11 inch tire.....the motor has shown no signs of slowing down...
    Par uses the newer Oval port head..

    Sounds to me you done been a around a little and know your way around pretty good..i have owned several camaro's and own a 67 and 69 now but no tall deck motors in either...

    good luck to you in what ever route you decide to go.
    Bjuice..

    "I'M YOUR HUCKLEBERRY ! "

  9. #9
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    bjuice, when I decide on what motor (short or tall deck) to build I will pm you for par's info. Can't seem to find a web site or anything for him, but lots of good news on his motors. Am I close on the price for what I am trying to do? Thanks for the info...

  10. #10
    Administrator RACING JUNKIE bjuice's Avatar
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    yes you are VERY close on the price...thats why i am pointing you his direction...for the money you are about to spend,,why not go with a TRUE custom engine....plus i have no doubts you will be extremely happy with the results..

    b]Par's custom built 565's and 582's (low deck) motors will run better than some of these mass manufactured 600+ ci motors being sold this day and time..[/b]

    PAR owners name is SCOTT DUGGINS....they do not have all the internet sited etc....its all word of mouth..SUPER NICE GUYS.....
    His number is 864-578-5622

    you also have to know that PAR and Fulton's shops are less than 30 minutes from each other..so he has some stiff competition to compete with on a day to day basis..

    Brian


    Brian
    Bjuice..

    "I'M YOUR HUCKLEBERRY ! "


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